Yann Magnan, a CEO, broke down what he spends on fitness.
iStock; Ava Horton/BI
Yann Magnan, 53, is the CEO of a software startup who lives in New York City and London.
He told BI’s Fitness Money Diaries series that he spends around $1,300 a month on keeping fit.
Magnan does 12 fitness classes a week. Every other week day he does two classes back-to-back from 6:10 a.m.
To share how much money you spend on health, fitness, and wellness with Business Insider’s Fitness Money Diaries, fill out this form.
Yann Magnan, the CEO of the startup software company 73 Strings, told Business Insider’s Fitness Money Diaries series that he spends $1,300a month on his health on average, to train for competitions and stay healthy as he ages.
Magnan, 53, who is French, switches between living in New York City and London every two to three months. He also spends between seven and 10 days each month traveling, often to San Francisco, Paris, Dubai, and Singapore. So his fitness routine has to be flexible, he said.
In April, Magnan will participate in his second Hyrox competition, an indoor fitness event consisting of eight functional exercises completed between eight kilometers of running.
To train for this, he runs and does around 12 fitness classes a week, including two back-to-back strength and cardio classes from 6 a.m. to 8 a.m. every other weekday.
Magnan competed in his first Hyrox competition last November.
“I have a pretty stressful life, and my work days are pretty extensive — they can be as long as 16 hours. So I need the time in the morning where I clear my head and do something different to get me into the day,” he said.
Overall, his goal is to age healthily. “The way I’m looking at things is that if I stay fit up to a certain level, I will stay in good health for a longer time. That’s how I look at it — as an investment in my future health,” he said.
“But I’m French, too, and I love good food and wine. So I do both. I go for a nice dinner and then the next day, I go to the gym to compensate.”
Here’s a breakdown of Magnan’s monthly spend on health and fitness.
Magnan does 12 classes a week to train for fitness competitions and to take time for himself each morning.
Yann Magnan/73 Strings
12 fitness classes a week at three different gyms: $1,116 a month
Magnan spends $270 a month on an unlimited class subscription at OrangeTheory, and goes to an hourlong, 7:15 a.m. class every morning when he’s in New York. The classes vary but typically involve high-intensity interval training, including weightlifting, running on a treadmill, and indoor rowing.
Each week, Magnan also takes five Barry’s Bootcamp classes — HIIT workouts using treadmills and weights — costing $37 each. He does 6:10 a.m. to 7 a.m. classes on Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays, as well as later ones on weekends.
“They target different things that I want to work on,” he said of OrangeTheory and Barry’s Bootcamp. “And I also want to be able to sustain a pretty intense effort for a long time — it’s a total of one hour 45 minutes.”
When he’s in London, Magnan pays £235 ($291) a month for membership at Third Space gyms, which offer similar high-intensity treadmill and weights classes.
Magnan often does workout classes with colleagues and clients.
Yann Magnan/73 Strings
One of his daughters often joins him at Barry’s Bootcamp in New York or Third Space when she’s in London. Magnan also does classes with clients and business partners whenever he can. This is in stark contrast to when he worked in France 15 years ago, and his business meetings were wine tastings or took place at fancy restaurants.
Running: $0
Magnan also goes running when he wants to add variety to his exercise routine, or when he’s traveling and doesn’t want to go to the gym.
Fitness competition entry fees: Around $300 per quarter
Magnan aims to do quarterly Hyrox competitions and half-marathons, he said. In April, he plans to run a half-marathon in New York and compete at Hyrox in Miami.
Both have entry fees — around $150-200 for marathons, and $150 for Hyrox competitions.
Magnan does high-intensity interval training and runs to stay fit.
Yann Magnan/73 Strings
Gym clothes and shoes: $1,260 a year
Magnan doesn’t buy any equipment for his training.
But each year he spends around $130 each on two pairs of gym shoes, usually in the run-up to a race, as well as about five pairs of workout shorts and five T-shirts.
These items, typically from stores like Lululemon, cost around $100 each.
Full physical examination: $1,500 every two years
Every two years, Magnan spends around $1,500 on a full-body physical examination with a private doctor in Paris. This measures markers of health such as his cardiovascular fitness and blood pressure.
Average total monthly spend on health and fitness: $1,321 (excluding his biennial physical)
Demoralized, stressed out, and struggling to take care of family members. Energized, efficient, and connected to their coworkers.
These are some of the feelings Amazon employees described in interviews with Business Insider as they adjust to its five-day return-to-office mandate.
We contacted dozens of employees to understand how the mandate was going 10 weeks into its rollout. Though most declined to speak, 11 people — including some who reached out on their own and two who were supplied by Amazon — gave us a detailed look at how RTO has affected their lives.
These are the experiences of those employees — including two who quit their jobs over the RTO mandate — told in their own words. Some requested anonymity citing fear of retaliation, and BI verified their employment. Quotes have been edited for length and clarity.
‘My job isn’t as good as it was two months ago.’
John Guballa was irritated when he found out about Amazon’s 5-day RTO policy.
John Guballa
John Guballa, 40, is based in Seattle. He worked at Amazon from 2011 to 2016 before rejoining the company in March 2024 as a senior risk manager.
When I came back to Amazon, I understood that I’d work three days a week in the office and could pick which days. My preference was to be entirely remote, but I took the job because I felt wanted by the hiring manager.
I was irritated when I found out about five-day RTO — it feels like they’re changing the rules.
Andy Jassy’s statements on RTO have been around culture and collaboration, but I don’t work closely with people in the same city as me. While I enjoy seeing some people at the office, we’re not getting any value in terms of collaboration.
Someone near me in the office posted a sign for “quiet hours” every day from 1 to 4 p.m. My impression is that they might feel that having people around is actually impairing them from doing what they need to do.
John Guballa saw this sign taped up at his Amazon office.
Photo courtesy of John Guballa.
Over the last several years, I’ve adapted and feel confident in my relationship-building with folks in a virtual environment. Collaboration wasn’t a problem, or at least not one that RTO would resolve. If you want people to get to know each other, I don’t think the method is dropping a cooler full of beers and saying, “Hey, socialize.” It would be better if leadership organized intentional team-building activities, but I haven’t seen that.
I’ve got two kids — a fourth grader and a kindergartner. They’ve got activities and doctor’s appointments, and somebody’s got to pick them up from the bus. I find myself having to push more of that toward my spouse, who works from home. We’re very blessed and fortunate to be two parents raising kids together and can manage it, but it’s adding a strain and inconvenience that I didn’t expect when I joined the company.
Five-day RTO has impacted how I think about my future at Amazon. The simple fact is that the expectations have changed, and my job isn’t as good as it was two months ago.
‘I’ve made connections you just can’t make virtually.’
Grace Cleveland commutes about an hour to her Amazon office in Boston.
Grace Cleveland
Grace Cleveland, 37, is based in Boston and joined Amazon in 2017, focusing on privacy and data handling within Alexa. Today, she leads global AI and privacy compliance in the workplace. In a written interview, she shared her experience with RTO5.
My commute is around one hour door-to-door. Amazon increased our monthly public transportation subsidy and has partnered with local restaurants to provide on-site lunch options.
In January, I traveled between four different offices — Berlin, Paris, New York, and Boston — and ran into people I didn’t know were in those offices, as they had transferred during the pandemic. These are connections you just can’t make virtually.
The days feel a bit longer, but I’m reading more books during my commute. My husband and I have had to make more proactive decisions about how we handle certain situations with our two young kids, ages 3 and 4. With hybrid work three days a week, I had more flexibility to be a present parent AND a good employee; being in the office full-time, I sometimes have to prioritize being a present parent OR a good employee.
In my opinion, the main benefit of RTO relates to Andy Jassy’s shareholder letter on building “primitives” — which in tech means that you’re building in blocks that can be shared and reused between teams. If we’re all virtual, it’s harder to know what other teams are doing. With RTO, I’ve been in conversations where we realized that we’re working on a similar solution, preventing duplicate work and connecting our teams to work toward a common path, which is better for everyone.
‘I’d thought Amazon could be a company I stayed at forever.’
Jason Murray quit his Amazon job in January 2025.
Jason Murray
Jason Murray, 31, was a senior art director at Amazon based in New York. He spent three years at the company before leaving in January. His office’s RTO5 plans were delayed until May 2025, but the mandate played a role in his decision to leave.
I moved to New York from Atlanta for this job. My wife and I had always wanted to try living in New York, and I thought I’d found the perfect blend of having a really creative job and work-life balance. I thought Amazon could be a company I stayed at forever.
I’m very introverted and have hyperhidrosis, which means I have the sweatiest hands on the planet, so any social interaction involving handshakes would make me very anxious. I’m a lot more productive at home, where I’m not being interrupted by spontaneous social interactions. I prefer to process and really dig into a problem first, and then send a note or swing by someone’s desk once I have a plan of action.
When three-day RTO was announced, it felt like the vision I had for my long-term future was dying. I knew that wasn’t my optimum lifestyle. My wife would text me pictures of our son, and I felt like I was missing so much.
I quit at the end of January to pursue freelance work. Since leaving, I’m still trying to find my rhythm with a more flexible schedule, and I’ve been rearranging my work to spend more time with my family. I love working from home and don’t regret leaving Amazon.
I get what some companies and their leadership might be thinking with RTO, but they’re ignoring their top talent. Not everyone performs and works their best in the office, and they’re going to lose their top-tier people.
‘RTO5 made me interested in applying to work at Amazon again.’
This employee in his 30s previously worked at Amazon, left for personal reasons, and returned last year. The five-day RTO announcement was a factor that influenced him to apply to rejoin Amazon, and he relocated to a major West Coast hub for the job.
When I heard about RTO5, I was curious and cautiously optimistic. It made me interested in applying to Amazon again.
When I was previously at Amazon, it was really difficult to get the attention of my coworkers and managers via Slack and Zoom. It’s really hard to connect with people when you can’t see them.
I was still pretty early in my career and had heard other former Amazon employees talk about the best part of the job being mentorship, coaching, and connections — I felt like I wasn’t getting that.
For me, RTO has been great. I’ve been able to form relationships with my teammates and with my manager, and I feel like I’m having a lot more visibility on issues that affect me. I’ve gotten to meet important people, and I’m really looking forward to the opportunity to mentor others and help them level up in their careers.
It’s been pretty flexible; they do want me there five days a week, but if I have a paper to write or if I’m studying for certifications, I’ve been able to do that at home or at study locations at some of the offices.
What makes Amazon so great is that they’re willing to be misunderstood. If they understand that something is going to be valuable, they’re going to do it, even if it’s unpopular. I’m cautiously optimistic that RTO5 will inspire positive change in terms of collaboration and leadership principles, but I think people are still adjusting.
‘This is no longer the company I signed up for.’
This employee in her 30s has been with the company for over 10 years and is based in the US. She worked remotely for several years prior to the RTO mandate. After the RTO3 mandate, she received an accommodation approval to work from home due to a disability affecting stress regulation.
Prior to these last two years, I didn’t feel any judgment from my team or the pressure to explain why I wasn’t in the office. I shouldn’t have to explain that I have an invisible disability so that I have the same respect I had three or four years ago, before RTO mandates were a thing. Getting on a video call where everyone else except me is in the office makes me feel the need to divulge very personal information to my peers.
When my accommodation was approved, I thought it would mean that the company would have to honor what my body needs to function and for me to contribute at my best. But instead, I’ve felt that I’m viewed as offering no value if I can’t be physically present. That’s not the Amazon that I’ve known and loved for so long.
I used to have a very clear, specific path in mind: stay at Amazon for no more than five years, with long-term aspirations of writing, speaking, and further academic pursuits. But I loved it so much that I’ve stayed for five more years. I’ve grown up here; it changed my life positively in so many ways.
But this is no longer the company I signed up for.There’s no recognition that one way of doing things doesn’t work for everybody, and the people who are most negatively impacted are going to be women, minorities, and other historically excluded populations.
‘There’s a benefit to being in-person as a new hire, but sometimes it feels unnecessary.’
This employee in his early 20s was hired out of college and joined the company in the second half of 2024, based out of the Seattle headquarters.
When I received my job offer, I was given paperwork that essentially said that RTO5 was coming, and by accepting the job, I was expected to comply. Looking back, I wonder, what was I thinking? But I was so excited to get the job — it’s a good salary and fun work at a great, well-respected company.
There’s a benefit to being in-person as a new hire; you can just walk over to one of your teammates and say, “Hey, how do I do XYZ?” and they can help you right away. When you’re virtual, it can take much longer to get past a simple problem.
I don’t have it that bad in terms of commute — a 20-minute commute in the morning and a 30-minute commute in the afternoon. I adjusted my working hours to be from around 7 a.m. to 3 p.m. to beat traffic; otherwise, my commute time would double.
But there are many days when I go into the office, have one video meeting, and don’t speak to anyone else. It feels like I wasted my time commuting into the office to do the exact same thing I could have done from home in the comfort of my sweats. It feels unnecessary.
RTO3 had been the perfect balance. On weekends, I used to hang out with friends or go on a hike. Now, I need my Saturdays to relax on the couch and Sundays to run errands that could’ve been done during the week.
Matt Garman touted that nine out of 10 people were excited to go to the office. I have no clue where he got that statistic because it doesn’t feel that way at all.
Enforcement of the policy seems to be left up to various managers; I’ve heard of some who are strict and some, like mine, who are looser about it.
I really do enjoy my job, but RTO5 has absolutely influenced how I see my future here. I’m trying to get promoted and leave to work at a hybrid or fully remote company as soon as I possibly can.
‘I was really itching to get back to having in-person interactions.’
Shane Marandi was excited when he heard about Amazon’s 5-day RTO mandate.
Shane Marandi
Shane Marandi, 34, is a senior finance manager at Amazon. He has been with the company for over seven years and worked in the office five days a week until COVID-19 hit. Amazon made him available for an interview.
When I heard the RTO5 announcement, I was excited. I was really itching to get back to having in-person interactions and strong doses of our in-person office culture.
I manage seven direct reports, and I like to make sure that everybody feels empowered to use good judgment when making their own day-to-day decisions. Respect the spirit of Andy’s note and of RTO5 and go from there; if that means you’ve got to work from home when your furniture’s delivered or if you need to travel that day and it makes sense to go from home straight to the airport, by all means, go ahead and do that. Amazon does a really good job hiring bright, intelligent folks, so I assume they have good judgment.
My team is able to get things done faster and we have a lot more fun together, having picnics on the lawn and going on walks together. That camaraderie is difficult to get in a hybrid environment.
RTO5 has also added more structure to my life. I have to make an effort to carve out time for my personal life, like hobbies. I take jiujitsu classes and play chess with friends and family, and in a hybrid or work-from-home environment, sometimes work hours would blend into the personal and I might work a little bit later into the night. Before I knew it, my hobbies had taken the backseat.
My commute to the office is about 30 to 45 minutes each way. For those of us from LA, the commute is just in our DNA. On the way home, I pop in a podcast or call my parents or siblings; it’s not as monotonous as one would think.
I empathize with people in different situations who struggle with RTO5 and hope that they can work through it. I think it’s a matter of time before folks really find what works for them and their manager, and then we should be good from there.
‘RTO5 might only attract one particular type of employee.’
This Amazon employee in his 20s is based in a major European city. He has worked at Amazon for over two years. His office’s RTO5 timeline has been delayed due to office capacity issues.
Even though we’re still under RTO3 at the moment, it’s quite hard to get desks in the office on busy days, especially Wednesdays. You might end up on a different floor from the rest of your team. I once had to search the entire building for a desk.
I feel my productivity is getting worse toward the end of the day. When I was working from home, there were things I’d do during lunch to take the edge off and help me refocus, such as going to the gym or taking a 10-minute nap. And every office has those coworkers with extremely loud voices and you can’t even hear your own thoughts.
There’s a big cultural difference in what makes an employer attractive in Europe. It’s more common here that people are aware that work only takes up part of your life, and it’s not your entire existence. Some people I’ve spoken to are concerned that RTO5 might only attract one particular type of employee, which isn’t what we’re used to from Amazon. Everyone values an extremely diverse culture with people of different backgrounds; that also means people with different working styles and different levels of time to invest in the job. I feel like some people might shy away who otherwise would’ve been a great fit for the company.
I’ve found myself questioning the culture that I was taught to love and appreciate about Amazon. But the culture of my immediate team hasn’t changed whatsoever; I still work with the kindest, smartest, and humblest people that I’ve ever had in my career. Everyone is trying to do the best within the realms that we can.
‘Caregivers often get left out.’
Jay Gorsica quit his Amazon job over the 5-day RTO mandate.
Jay Gorsica
Jay Gorsica, 47, was a design engineer at Amazon based in Columbus, Ohio. He joined the company in 2017 and worked there for seven years and eight months before leaving in January 2025.
In August 2022, my wife had a traumatic brain injury and was hospitalized for several months. She now has permanent disabilities; she can’t use her right arm and has limited use of her right leg.
I take care of pretty much everything — cleaning and sterilizing her tracheostomy tube, helping her bathe, and cooking — every day.
When RTO3 was announced, I was very concerned. I joined Remote Advocacy, an internal Slack channel, and started to pay attention to other people’s stories. I heard from military spouses, caregivers, parents of special needs kids, and people who were being asked to relocate.
Jay Gorsica and his wife Carrie.
Photo courtesy of Jay Gorsica
For me, the issue was less about returning to office and more about the possibility of a relocation mandate. I didn’t want the company to try to haul us across the country and have to find a whole new suite of doctors for Carrie.
When the RTO5 announcement dropped, I knew I had to find another job. I started posting on LinkedIn to drum up some engagement, broaden my network, and leverage connections. In late November, a recruiter reached out about a project management role, and I got the job.
I put my two-week notice in the second week of January. My boss had known about my situation and that I’d been looking; I didn’t keep it a secret, and he was pretty supportive.
My new job is the best of all worlds. I had to take an 18% pay cut in base salary, but it was more important to me to have a job that allowed me to meet my obligations.
I think most of the arguments about collaboration and productivity in relation to RTO are disingenuous. There is a wealth of data that supports flexibility and the hybrid approach. Not to mention, there are DEI benefits in supporting neurodivergent workers, caregivers, single mothers, and other workers who need flexibility. Caregivers often get left out of arguments supporting the need for flexibility, but there are a ton of people who are caregivers for children, a spouse, or parents. There’s going to come a point where there will need to be some sort of accommodation in work structure and flexibility because there will be such a huge amount of people in this bucket.
‘It’s been easier to really feel like a connected community.’
Cash Ashley started working from his Amazon office even before the RTO mandate.
Cash Ashley
Cash Ashley, 37, works in sales as an enterprise account manager at Amazon Web Services. He is based in Washington, DC, and has been with the company for just over four years. Amazon made him available for an interview.
I was a remote COVID hire. I’ve worked in retail leadership for a big part of my life and have always been in environments where the community of people is what differentiates the experience, so I missed being around people.
I was happy to work at Amazon, but I felt like something was missing because we weren’t in the office. You go out to Seattle and see all these crazy buildings and everything, but then you’re hired and you’re in your living room with a standing desk.
I started going into the office before we even had to. I’m just a talkative person, and I think a lot of people in the office know me.
I lead an employee affinity group — Amazon’s Black Employee Network — in my office, and it’s been exciting to be able to connect with people, host events, and do community service together. It’s been easier to really feel like a connected community. In December, we hosted a local Boys and Girls Club; it was fun to fully activate this campus.
But I’m not a robot; it’s not always amazing. There are some life routines I’ve had to shift, like waking up much earlier now. Three years ago, I might’ve had a boxing class at 9 a.m., but now I don’t. But I’m an optimistic, positive person. Everybody deserves community — I think it’s so powerful.
‘A two-hour commute each way is unsustainable.’
An Amazon employee in his 40s lives over 50 miles outside the major North American city where his assigned office is based. He has worked remotely for over 10 years.
I never would’ve accepted this job if there was any possibility of it not being virtual. My commute takes well over two hours each way and involves driving, taking public transportation, and walking. Going in for a full workday would involve leaving the house before 6 a.m. and only getting home past 8 p.m. My kids come home from their school bus at 3:45 p.m., and I want to be with them by 5 p.m. I’ve been more irritable and my wife and I have had more tension in our relationship.
I have nothing against working in an office, but for my role, it just doesn’t make sense, as the majority of the customer-facing work I do can’t be performed in the office. Most of my peers in the same role are fully remote, but a few of us fell through the cracks and were assigned offices. I applied for an exception, but my request was rejected.
With RTO5, I’ve had to — with my direct manager’s support — find ways to avoid needing to go to the office, like taking PTO, scheduling doctor’s appointments, or doing tasks that require me to work from home. But I’ve still had to go in several times. I need to maintain this status quo until later this year when my next stock vests. If nothing is resolved by then, I might have to call it a day.
A spokesperson for Amazon referred Business Insider to the points in Andy Jassy’s September 2024 RTO memo about strengthening the company’s culture and remote work flexibility, and gave the following statement: “Business Insider declined to share the information needed for us to verify the details of these essays, which unfortunately makes it difficult to separate truth from fiction. We’re excited by the innovation, collaboration, and connection that we’ve seen already with our teams working in person together.” In regard to the struggle to find desks, the spokesperson said that Amazon has “heard ideas for improvement from a relatively small number of employees and are working to address those. With most employees working from the office each day, teams across the company are focused on ensuring the transition is as smooth as possible as we continue to deliver for customers.”
Good morning. Spring is often a good time to sell a house. But amid DOGE’s sweeping budget cuts, this year could be completely different — if buyers realize how much leverage they have.
The consumer price index rose 0.2%, showing that prices cooled slightly more last month than economists had expected. The increase was the smallest in four months — and enough to immediately lift spirits and markets alike.
Though major US indexes pared increases as the day progressed, Magnificent Seven tech stocks all gained, notably Nvidia and Tesla.
The data was enough to give markets more confidence that the Federal Reserve has additional flexibility to fight a stalling economy with rate cuts — one of its most crucial anti-recession tools, BI’s Jennifer Sor writes.
It also alleviated — at least temporarily — half the equation for a fate worse than a recession: stagflation (the dreaded S-word).
So, are we at the bottom yet?
David Kostin, the chief US equity strategist at Goldman Sachs, issued a note on Tuesday that laid out three factors that could drive a swift recovery in the stock market:
1. A silver lining amid Trump-induced market mayhem. Investors are exhausted after recent financial market chaos, but there’s one perk for weary homebuyers: lower mortgage rates. The 30- and 15-year mortgage rates have both steadily dipped for six weeks straight alongside bond yields.
2. Balyasny’s intern-recruiting tactic involves some friendly competition. The $23 billion hedge fund hosted its first-ever stock-pitching contest for college students last October, and it’s now a regular part of the recruiting process. The top teams get prize money, but the real reward is an interview for the firm’s summer internship.
subjug/Getty, undefined/Getty, spxChrome/Getty, iStock/Baris-Ozer, Ava Horton/BI
1. Streaming is more expensive — and uneven— than ever. Services like Netflix and Spotify used to charge one price for everything. Now, you get what you pay for. It’s splitting users into haves and have-nots.
2. Another shuffle at Google Cloud. The strategy and operations team became the latest to undergo restructuring, according to an internal memo viewed by BI. The company consolidated teams to “respond faster” to the market and to boost sales productivity, the memo said.
3. AMD CEO Lisa Su won’t settle for second in the family affair. When analysts criticized AMD’s software, Su got back on the horse and listened to their feedback. Despite rival Nvidia’s dominance, sources said Su won’t rest until she defeats the chip giant, led by her cousin Jensen Huang.
3 things in business
Scott Eisen/Getty Images; AP; Rebecca Zisser/BI
1. Harvard’s plan to “play by Trump’s rules.” President Trump has been targeting elite universities on various fronts, from campus protests to DEI initiatives. Harvard’s solution? Cozy up with Trump’s allies. Here’s the Ivy League school’s threefold strategy to fend off federal cuts.
2. Costco looks like the big winner following Target’s DEI rollback. Corporate social responsibility was part of both retailers’ brand identities until Target recently seesawed its position on DEI. Now, that might be coming back to bite it. A new survey indicates customers are shopping at Costco instead.
3. Klarna employees are on edge ahead of IPO. The buy-now, pay-later startup is getting lean by restructuring teams and moving some employees into a “talent pool” as it preps for a public debut. BI heard from 11 current and former staffers about what the changes mean for their jobs and the company’s future.
In other news
Trump’s tariffs on steel and aluminum have begun. Here are the top countries that supply America’s metal imports.
Commerce Secretary Howard Lutnick meets with Ontario Premier Doug Ford for trade talks in Washington, DC.
The Insider Today team: Dan DeFrancesco, deputy editor and anchor, in New York (on parental leave). Grace Lett, editor, in Chicago. Ella Hopkins, associate editor, in London. Hallam Bullock, senior editor, in London. Amanda Yen, associate editor, in New York. Elizabeth Casolo, fellow, in Chicago. Lisa Ryan, executive editor, New York.
Chip Somodevilla/Getty, Patrick T. Fallon/Bloomberg/Getty, Ava Horton/BI
Business Insider reviewed a copy of xAI’s internal organizational chart.
Elon Musk’s direct reports include Igor Babuschkin, Ross Nordeen, Jimmy Ba, Jared Birchall, and Daniel Rowland.
The ranks also include former Tesla and Google engineers and Musk’s son.
At xAI, Elon Musk has marshaled a workforce that has ballooned by more than 1,000 employees in less than two years as he goes head-to-head with rivals OpenAI and Google.
Business Insider reviewed the company’s internal organizational chart to identify and understand the people near the top of the AI venture as of early this year. The chart, which included names, titles, and other information, features former Tesla and Google engineers, Musk’s home office manager, and his son.
As CEO, Musk oversees a team of more than 1,200 people. Five employees report directly to the billionaire: xAI founding team members Igor Babuschkin, Ross Nordeen, and Jimmy Ba; longtime Musk aide Jared Birchall; and Daniel Rowland, whose involvement in the company hasn’t been previously reported.
Marc Piasecki/Getty, Patrick T. Fallon/Bloomberg/Getty, Ava Horton/BI
A spokesperson for xAI did not respond to a request for comment.
Musk, Ba, Rowland, Birchall, Babuschkin, and Nordeen did not respond to a request for comment.
Here’s what we know about Musk’s direct reports.
Jimmy Ba
Ba was one of Musk’s first hires at xAI. He appeared on a livestream alongside Musk and a handful of other xAI employees when the company unveiled the latest version of Grok in February.
Several of Ba’s direct reports joined the company as “Member of Technical Staff” within the past few months, including Pawan Bhandarkar and Satvik Ramaprasad, according to their LinkedIn profiles.
Most xAI employees roll up to Ba, including around 900 AI “tutors,” the hourly employees who train the company’s chatbot, Grok. These workers report to team leads who are overseen by “human data managers.” The majority of tutors work remotely, and some work outside the US.
Outside his work at xAI, Ba is an assistant professor at the University of Toronto. He’s part of the Machine Learning Group, faculty from the computer science department who work on various projects involving artificial intelligence. He received his Ph.D. from the school while studying under the Nobel Prize winner Geoffrey Hinton, who has been referred to as the “godfather of AI.”
Daniel Rowland
Rowland joined xAI nearly a year ago and oversees both of xAI’s data centers, according to the organizational chart.
The company built its Memphis data center — which Musk has said is the largest in the world, and which the company has said houses more than 200,000 GPUs — in 122 days, a fraction of the time it typically takes to build such a facility. The company also has two other facilities in Memphis, including a wastewater treatment plant and a site that was announced in March. Musk has said the company plans to scale the site, which he has nicknamed “Colossus,” to 2 million GPUs in the coming year.
Rowland has a team of a few dozen people, including eight direct reports. In January, two of those employees left Tesla’s Dojo project, which is focused on building the carmaker’s custom supercomputer, to join the data center project, LinkedIn profiles show.
Brent Mayo, a former SpaceX engineer, also reports to Rowland. Mayo has become the face of xAI in Memphis, where he frequently engages with local officials and serves as the senior manager of site builds and infrastructure. Rowland’s other direct reports include Alexander Coppess, Andy Kim, Lee Meyer, and Liz Balke.
Rowland’s team is primarily based out of Memphis, but he has one employee listed as a data center technician based in Atlanta.
BI was unable to confirm details of Rowland’s professional background. A hardware engineer named Daniel Rowland has worked on Tesla’s Dojo supercomputer since 2018, according to his LinkedIn profile and internal documentation reviewed by BI.
Tesla did not respond to a request for comment.
Igor Babuschkin
Babuschkin previously worked at Google DeepMind.
Babuschkin manages the most people directly at xAI, with 29 direct reports. One of his team members includes Kai Musk, Elon Musk’s son, according to the chart. Musk is listed in xAI’s directory as an “Engineering Intern” on the company’s “Engineering Strike Team.” His involvement with the company has not been previously reported.
When asked about his position at the company, Kai Musk responded from his xAI email address that “this information is incorrect.” He declined to comment further and did not respond to follow-up questions.
Both previously worked at Musk’s X and Neuralink, according to Moghaddassi’s LinkedIn profile and an archived version of Elez’s LinkedIn profile. Elez was listed as an “active” employee at xAI in February; four days after BI reached out to xAI about his employment, his company email address stopped working.
Other people listed as members of the xAI Partner department under Babuschkin include Aqueel Miqdad and Anton Shevchenko, who both list X as their current employer on LinkedIn.
Jared Birchall
Birchall is listed as an “xAI Partner” on the organizational chart, but he does not report to Babuschkin. His team includes members of the finance, legal, security, and HR teams. His direct reports include Robert Ochoa, the human resources lead; Robert Keele, the legal lead; and Pablo Mendoza, the finance lead.
Birchall, like Rowland, is listed as a remote employee.
The former Morgan Stanley banker also serves as the CEO of Musk’s brain chip startup, Neuralink, and he has run Musk’s family office for nine years.
Ross Nordeen
Nordeen has no direct reports. He was a technical program manager at Tesla before he joined xAI in 2023, according to an internal Tesla database from December 2021.
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